Random Philosophical Thoughts
Sep. 26th, 2010 10:37 pm![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
crossover_chickI've been rereading bits and pieces of Tim Allen's book I'm Not Really Here, and something about some of the discussions on the nature of God sparked a thought about Corpse Bride. Specifically, how the hell is Victor (and hell, probably the rest of the town) supposed to get back to a normal life?
Let me put it like this: The town in Corpse Bride is nominally Christian. (The original folktale is Jewish, yes, but we're just focusing on the movie here). That is, they've got a church, and they've got a pastor. This seems to indicate that the town is Protestant, though Wikipedia says some of the other branches of Christianity use the term too. Whatever they are exactly, they're Christian. Now, this means Victor's grown up in that faith, right? He's probably gone to church all his life. His background includes a religion that's told him there's two afterlives -- heaven for the good, hell for the bad. Possibly he's heard of purgatory, I'm not up on who gets taught what. He's also probably been taught that magic doesn't exist (except for miracles), or if it does, it's evil witchcraft. (I can definitely see Pastor Galswells taking that line.) He most likely never thought twice about what he's learned theologically.
Then he marries a corpse bride.
Now, think about this for a minute. At the end of the movie, Victor's received what amounts to a MAJOR mindfuck! He's not only temporarily raised the dead, he's discovered the afterlife is not at all what he thinks it should be! The Land of the Dead wasn't mentioned in any Bible. Some people do believe it's a form of purgatory, but let's face it -- none of us know the rules. And neither does Victor. He's seen an afterlife that is neither eternal punishment nor eternal paradise -- it's just life with brighter colors, rotting flesh, and the fun meter turned up to the maximum. One where dogs and children can end up no less. And he's learned that magic is in fact real -- if being dragged down to the Land of the Dead by a corpse bride wasn't proof enough, Elder Gutknecht's Ukrainian Haunting Spell had to be. Everything he's been taught to believe may in fact be wrong. How exactly do you deal with that?
As for the villagers -- they saw the dead fucking rise. And while it was a happy event overall, that's gotta leave some confusion/fear/what have you behind. How do they deal with it?
Most fanfic writers I've seen who write about Victor and Victoria post-CB gloss over this. Player Piano's fics, for example, are all pretty simple pieces about an ordinary life between two people in love. One of her fics did deal a little with how weird it was for everything to just go back to normal, but the damn thing's unfinished, and I'm not entirely sure everything would. Another does touch upon Victor's parents and Victor having an argument about whether or not this "Land of the Dead" really exists, though the main thrust of that fic is people thinking Victor faked his own death to commit adultery and then murdered Barkis Bittern (and this one is unfinished too). Most fics, though, just focus in on Victor and Victoria having kids or something like that.
To be fair, though, what little I've written for canon-related CB (instead of hooking Victor up with Alice) does the same. I do mention in "Corpse Mask" that Stephen, Victor's friend and the "Charlie" analogue (from The Mask) thought he'd initially moved into a town of lunatics when he first heard the corpse bride story. And Pastor Galswells now very firmly believes that Victor is touched by Satan (in "Bonds of Holy Matrimony," my Victor/Victoria wedding fic, he actually refuses to marry them because of this). It's a tough issue to tackle, though, especially when you're as theologically impaired as I am. (My family and I don't really believe in any organized religion, ya see.) I suppose I should be thankful I'm more interested in hooking up Victor and Alice and dodging most of the issue. Though, if I ever wanted to try and get that "Victor goes a little crazy after the movie" fic off the ground. . . .
Anyway, sorry to ramble at you all like this -- I really just needed to get it out of my head.
Let me put it like this: The town in Corpse Bride is nominally Christian. (The original folktale is Jewish, yes, but we're just focusing on the movie here). That is, they've got a church, and they've got a pastor. This seems to indicate that the town is Protestant, though Wikipedia says some of the other branches of Christianity use the term too. Whatever they are exactly, they're Christian. Now, this means Victor's grown up in that faith, right? He's probably gone to church all his life. His background includes a religion that's told him there's two afterlives -- heaven for the good, hell for the bad. Possibly he's heard of purgatory, I'm not up on who gets taught what. He's also probably been taught that magic doesn't exist (except for miracles), or if it does, it's evil witchcraft. (I can definitely see Pastor Galswells taking that line.) He most likely never thought twice about what he's learned theologically.
Then he marries a corpse bride.
Now, think about this for a minute. At the end of the movie, Victor's received what amounts to a MAJOR mindfuck! He's not only temporarily raised the dead, he's discovered the afterlife is not at all what he thinks it should be! The Land of the Dead wasn't mentioned in any Bible. Some people do believe it's a form of purgatory, but let's face it -- none of us know the rules. And neither does Victor. He's seen an afterlife that is neither eternal punishment nor eternal paradise -- it's just life with brighter colors, rotting flesh, and the fun meter turned up to the maximum. One where dogs and children can end up no less. And he's learned that magic is in fact real -- if being dragged down to the Land of the Dead by a corpse bride wasn't proof enough, Elder Gutknecht's Ukrainian Haunting Spell had to be. Everything he's been taught to believe may in fact be wrong. How exactly do you deal with that?
As for the villagers -- they saw the dead fucking rise. And while it was a happy event overall, that's gotta leave some confusion/fear/what have you behind. How do they deal with it?
Most fanfic writers I've seen who write about Victor and Victoria post-CB gloss over this. Player Piano's fics, for example, are all pretty simple pieces about an ordinary life between two people in love. One of her fics did deal a little with how weird it was for everything to just go back to normal, but the damn thing's unfinished, and I'm not entirely sure everything would. Another does touch upon Victor's parents and Victor having an argument about whether or not this "Land of the Dead" really exists, though the main thrust of that fic is people thinking Victor faked his own death to commit adultery and then murdered Barkis Bittern (and this one is unfinished too). Most fics, though, just focus in on Victor and Victoria having kids or something like that.
To be fair, though, what little I've written for canon-related CB (instead of hooking Victor up with Alice) does the same. I do mention in "Corpse Mask" that Stephen, Victor's friend and the "Charlie" analogue (from The Mask) thought he'd initially moved into a town of lunatics when he first heard the corpse bride story. And Pastor Galswells now very firmly believes that Victor is touched by Satan (in "Bonds of Holy Matrimony," my Victor/Victoria wedding fic, he actually refuses to marry them because of this). It's a tough issue to tackle, though, especially when you're as theologically impaired as I am. (My family and I don't really believe in any organized religion, ya see.) I suppose I should be thankful I'm more interested in hooking up Victor and Alice and dodging most of the issue. Though, if I ever wanted to try and get that "Victor goes a little crazy after the movie" fic off the ground. . . .
Anyway, sorry to ramble at you all like this -- I really just needed to get it out of my head.
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no subject
Date: 2010-09-27 04:15 am (UTC)Personally, I think the vast majority of people would convince themselves that it was all a dream or mass hallucination - this might be useful for exonerating Victor and Victoria for any fallout from Barkis' death/"disappearance". On the other hand, there is now plenty of drama to be gotten from the fact that everybody sorta knows what happened, but only Victor and Victoria take it seriously. OR DO THEY . . . that little girl who was reunited with her grandfather for the evening would make an excellent focus for how zealously the residents of the village will stamp out any overt acknowledgement of the event.
As for Victor and Victoria's personal religious beliefs, you can make a pretty good argument that the Land of the Dead is, in fact, Purgatory - after all, we see Emily disappear in a cloud of butterflies, which could be interpreted as ascension to Heaven. And of course, even though Barkis is dragged off by the dead, we're not going to see him hanging around the Ball and Socket, are we?
On the other hand, of course, sweeping changes to Victor and Victoria's worldview means that all kinds of tensions will escalate between them and the rest of the townsfolk. Who knows - maybe they leave town altogether, perhaps even looking up the infamously eccentric occult scientist Emmet Von Braun, and his apprentice Martin. ;-)
But for a fic not focused on sweeping changes, It's Purgatory + Highly Advanced Science would make a decent enough handwave.
no subject
Date: 2010-09-27 11:55 am (UTC)You've got a point -- I'm sure the vast majority of the village would be very happy in going, "Okay, nice to see everyone again, now let's never speak of it again" at the very least. Though maybe Gertrude (that old lady with the walker) wouldn't mind. And that little kid (who, er, is a boy, actually) would be hard to shut up. *imagines parents having to bribe him whenever they go someplace not to talk about the time Grandpa came back from the dead*
As for Victoria and particularly Victor, I can see them going with the Purgatory view -- that's more or less how one of Player Piano's fanfics handles it. (Of course, she says that you also end up forgetting everything before the whole butterfly business, which happens to SCARE THE CRAP OUT OF ME.) I'm honestly not sure what to believe when it comes to that place -- neither are a bunch of other people, it seems (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/JustBugsMe/CorpseBride). Nevertheless, no matter how death works, they've been through some major changes. There's bound to be friction. For example, how do they explain things to Victor's parents (should they return from driving out of the movie)? Nell and William weren't around to see the dead rise. What about Pastor Galswells, who obviously did NOT taking the rising of the dead well? Victor in particular is probably going to feel rather isolated, because he saw all this first-hand.
*nodnod, then puzzlement* Why Purgatory + Highly Advanced Science? Seems like the first would be enough for most people.
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